OT Why I get organic eggs

[NightMist]

Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.

While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.

I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics.
Every now and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become
rather violently ill with an allergic reaction. It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it. The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs. If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs. If I want an egg for breakfast,
or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are more than worth
the extra money for me.

Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.

NightMist

[Ruby]

The use of antibiotics (developed for humans) and used in animal
farming, is one of the reasons for the rise in antibiotic resistant
bacteria. these antibiotics are used so that animals may be raised in
crowded and for the animal not optimum health conditions. Also the use
of hormones is concerning. But as long as we desire cheap food it will
persist. Compared to per capita income the Americans spend less than
most countries of there income on food.
That was one of the first differences that I noticed when I visited Uk
and Europe many years ago. people there seemed to buy the best food they
could afford. However for the younger generations I think that is
changing. They prefer the latest toys.
I was raised that income was for the staples, food, housing and
clothing. anything left over was gravy and dream money.
It is amazing at the difference in my children, one having after leaving
home lived in UK for 10 years and one having lived in USA for 8. How
their eating habits learned at home have been affected by culture. My
son must make even sauces from scratch as he is allergic to the additive
that we in north America add to all liquids (every thing from salad
dressing to soft drinks)to promote shelf life, it is banned in Britain .
It took us years to figure out why he broke out in terrible rashes every
time he visited home. It was the soy sauce , one of the few purchased
sauces in our house.
Ruby
Ruby

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics.
Every now and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become
rather violently ill with an allergic reaction. It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it. The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs. If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs. If I want an egg for breakfast,
or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are more than worth
the extra money for me.
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.
NightMist

[Polly Esther]

Hmmm, Ruby. What an interesting discovery. I do everything 'but' scrub our
salad fixings with a wire brush and boil them in bleach - and still . . .
DH's digestive system reacts to a just plain old green salad. Maybe it's
not the celery ( or whatever), maybe it's the salad dressing. I'm sure
there are 10,000 salad dressing recipes here and I certainly can make one
without nasty additives. You just may have made some magic. Thank you.
Really, really thank you. Polly

"Ruby" <> The use of antibiotics (developed for humans) and used in animal

Post by Ruby
farming, is one of the reasons for the rise in antibiotic resistant
bacteria. these antibiotics are used so that animals may be raised in
crowded and for the animal not optimum health conditions. Also the use of
hormones is concerning. But as long as we desire cheap food it will
persist. Compared to per capita income the Americans spend less than most
countries of there income on food.
That was one of the first differences that I noticed when I visited Uk and
Europe many years ago. people there seemed to buy the best food they could
afford. However for the younger generations I think that is changing.
They prefer the latest toys.
I was raised that income was for the staples, food, housing and clothing.
anything left over was gravy and dream money.
It is amazing at the difference in my children, one having after leaving
home lived in UK for 10 years and one having lived in USA for 8. How their
eating habits learned at home have been affected by culture. My son must
make even sauces from scratch as he is allergic to the additive that we in
north America add to all liquids (every thing from salad dressing to soft
drinks)to promote shelf life, it is banned in Britain . It took us years
to figure out why he broke out in terrible rashes every time he visited
home. It was the soy sauce , one of the few purchased sauces in our
house.
Ruby

[Jo Gibson]

Post by Polly Esther
Hmmm, Ruby. What an interesting discovery. I do everything 'but' scrub
our salad fixings with a wire brush and boil them in bleach - and still
. . . DH's digestive system reacts to a just plain old green salad.
Maybe it's not the celery ( or whatever), maybe it's the salad dressing.
I'm sure there are 10,000 salad dressing recipes here and I certainly
can make one without nasty additives. You just may have made some magic.
Thank you. Really, really thank you. Polly
"Ruby" <> The use of antibiotics (developed for humans) and used in animal

Post by Ruby
farming, is one of the reasons for the rise in antibiotic resistant
bacteria. these antibiotics are used so that animals may be raised in
crowded and for the animal not optimum health conditions. Also the use
of hormones is concerning. But as long as we desire cheap food it will
persist. Compared to per capita income the Americans spend less than
most countries of there income on food.
That was one of the first differences that I noticed when I visited Uk
and Europe many years ago. people there seemed to buy the best food
they could afford. However for the younger generations I think that is
changing. They prefer the latest toys.
I was raised that income was for the staples, food, housing and
clothing. anything left over was gravy and dream money.
It is amazing at the difference in my children, one having after
leaving home lived in UK for 10 years and one having lived in USA for
8. How their eating habits learned at home have been affected by
culture. My son must make even sauces from scratch as he is allergic
to the additive that we in north America add to all liquids (every
thing from salad dressing to soft drinks)to promote shelf life, it is
banned in Britain . It took us years to figure out why he broke out in
terrible rashes every time he visited home. It was the soy sauce , one
of the few purchased sauces in our house.
Ruby

There are millions of salad dressings, but I like this one:

Get a small clean jar with a screw-on lid
Crush a clove of garlic into the jar
Freshly grind some black pepper into the jar
Add equal measures of balsamic vinegar and the best olive oil you can afford

Shake, shake shake! Use within a couple of days. If you put it into
the fridge, it will all settle out, so pop it in the microwave for 20
seconds and then shake again just before you use it. Gorgeous, fresh
and no strange ingredients!


-- Jo in Scotland

[Roberta]

Just got back from a week away and saw this. Can't resist sending you
my salad dressing "recipe": slosh olive oil (the very best you can
find) into the bottom of the salad bowl. Add lemon juice,to about
half the volume of oil (or you may use vinegar if you prefer). Season
to taste with salt and pepper and fresh herbs and a bit of chopped
onion and some garlic. Let it sit for a couple of minutes, give it a
good stir, then toss with the salad greens. I don't measure anything,
and somehow it always works. Takes maybe a minute to make, so no
excuses for using nasty bottled additives.
Roberta in D

On Sat, 17 Jul 2010 22:33:42 -0500, "Polly Esther"

Post by Polly Esther
Hmmm, Ruby. What an interesting discovery. I do everything 'but' scrub our
salad fixings with a wire brush and boil them in bleach - and still . . .
DH's digestive system reacts to a just plain old green salad. Maybe it's
not the celery ( or whatever), maybe it's the salad dressing. I'm sure
there are 10,000 salad dressing recipes here and I certainly can make one
without nasty additives. You just may have made some magic. Thank you.
Really, really thank you. Polly
"Ruby" <> The use of antibiotics (developed for humans) and used in animal

Post by Ruby
farming, is one of the reasons for the rise in antibiotic resistant
bacteria. these antibiotics are used so that animals may be raised in
crowded and for the animal not optimum health conditions. Also the use of
hormones is concerning. But as long as we desire cheap food it will
persist. Compared to per capita income the Americans spend less than most
countries of there income on food.
That was one of the first differences that I noticed when I visited Uk and
Europe many years ago. people there seemed to buy the best food they could
afford. However for the younger generations I think that is changing.
They prefer the latest toys.
I was raised that income was for the staples, food, housing and clothing.
anything left over was gravy and dream money.
It is amazing at the difference in my children, one having after leaving
home lived in UK for 10 years and one having lived in USA for 8. How their
eating habits learned at home have been affected by culture. My son must
make even sauces from scratch as he is allergic to the additive that we in
north America add to all liquids (every thing from salad dressing to soft
drinks)to promote shelf life, it is banned in Britain . It took us years
to figure out why he broke out in terrible rashes every time he visited
home. It was the soy sauce , one of the few purchased sauces in our
house.
Ruby

[J*]

soy products are a fairly common allergen
yet they are used in sooooo many products and
not reading labels, we carry on oblivious to what is causing us problems..
i have a friend and my dd who both have reactions to soy tho not bad rashes
that you describe.
as far as i know i'm not allergic to it.
our regular eggs cost about $2.80 a dozen.
not sure what the organic or free range cost here.
dd, ds and there respective flatmates only eat free range.
we should too. might need to have a chat with dh about this...he does the
shopping.
thanks, Nightmist and Ruby, for getting us all do some thinking about what
we eat.
j.

"Ruby" wrote ...
The use of antibiotics (developed for humans) and used in animal
farming, is one of the reasons for the rise in antibiotic resistant
bacteria. these antibiotics are used so that animals may be raised in
crowded and for the animal not optimum health conditions. Also the use
of hormones is concerning. But as long as we desire cheap food it will
persist. Compared to per capita income the Americans spend less than
most countries of there income on food.
That was one of the first differences that I noticed when I visited Uk
and Europe many years ago. people there seemed to buy the best food they
could afford. However for the younger generations I think that is
changing. They prefer the latest toys.
I was raised that income was for the staples, food, housing and
clothing. anything left over was gravy and dream money.
It is amazing at the difference in my children, one having after leaving
home lived in UK for 10 years and one having lived in USA for 8. How
their eating habits learned at home have been affected by culture. My
son must make even sauces from scratch as he is allergic to the additive
that we in north America add to all liquids (every thing from salad
dressing to soft drinks)to promote shelf life, it is banned in Britain .
It took us years to figure out why he broke out in terrible rashes every
time he visited home. It was the soy sauce , one of the few purchased
sauces in our house.
Ruby
Ruby

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics.
Every now and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become
rather violently ill with an allergic reaction. It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it. The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs. If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs. If I want an egg for breakfast,
or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are more than worth
the extra money for me.
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.
NightMist

[Dr. Zachary Smith]

Wow, they're that expensive? DW is carpooling with a woman who raises
her own chickens, and we've been getting eggs from her ('cuz I've
always liked the taste of corn-fed chickens & eggs better). I know
they're a little more than Weggie'$, but I don't think it's 4x... You
gotta have some farmers out where you are - are they all that high?

Doc

I never knew there *was* such a thing as store-bought salad dressing
until I started eating away from home - (of course I never knew there
was any kind of dressing other than the horrible vinegar concoction my
mom used to make either...) I think now we use Marie's dressings from
the produce section (DW can't keep her face out of the bleu cheese) -
I'd have to read the labels, but I 'spect they're not quite as bad as
the shelf stuff... Fortunately salad dressings are fairly easy & fun
to experiment with!

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics.
Every now and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become
rather violently ill with an allergic reaction.  It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it.  The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs.  If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs.  If I want an egg for breakfast,
or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are more than worth
the extra money for me.  
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.
NightMist
--
I'm raising a developmentally disabled child.  What's your superpower?

[NightMist]

Yep, here they are that expensive.
Mostly because we have to buy them black market. There is a legitimate
certified organic farm out in Kennedy, but getting our kiri to drive out
there is a problem. She is a big city girl and has a bit of an issue
with out of town non-highway driving. None of the grocery stores sell
these eggs, so we have to get them under the table from a place that is
not a food store. You know what a hassle that can be in this state.
They might turn a blind eye in an area like this to a road side stand
selling their own eggs during season, but an actual shop would likely get
the book thrown at them.

So far as soy, I am really ticked off about that.
I know a guy who grows a heritage variety for his own use. The japanese
"beer friend" variety to be specific. I have no problem eating those.
For years I had no problem eating any kind of soy. Then all of a sudden
I ate a soy sausage and nearly ended up in the ER. My throat darned near
swelled shut and it felt like I was trying to breathe with a hundred
pound weight on my chest. Judicious experimentation has led me to
believe that it is the GMO soy that gives me trouble. Since more than
90% of the US crop is either GMO or GMO contaminated that pretty much
excludes soy from my diet. I can eat beer friend beans all night long,
but a commercial soy burger is life threatening. Grrr!

NightMist

Post by Dr. Zachary Smith
Wow, they're that expensive? DW is carpooling with a woman who raises
her own chickens, and we've been getting eggs from her ('cuz I've always
liked the taste of corn-fed chickens & eggs better). I know they're a
little more than Weggie'$, but I don't think it's 4x... You gotta have
some farmers out where you are - are they all that high?
Doc
I never knew there *was* such a thing as store-bought salad dressing
until I started eating away from home - (of course I never knew there
was any kind of dressing other than the horrible vinegar concoction my
mom used to make either...) I think now we use Marie's dressings from
the produce section (DW can't keep her face out of the bleu cheese) -
I'd have to read the labels, but I 'spect they're not quite as bad as
the shelf stuff... Fortunately salad dressings are fairly easy & fun to
experiment with!

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics. Every now
and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become rather
violently ill with an allergic reaction.  It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it.  The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs.  If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs.  If I want an egg for
breakfast, or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are
more than worth the extra money for me.
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.
NightMist
--
I'm raising a developmentally disabled child.  What's your superpower?

[Dr. Zachary Smith]

Night,

I just checked with management.
Eggs at Weggie$ are about a buck;
Pastel carpool eggs are a buck-fifty.

I expect your middlemen are getting the bulk.

We used to get pastels from a friend in the Finger Lakes whenever we
saw her, but that's been years...

Got a good co-op down there?

Doc

Post by NightMist
Yep, here they are that expensive.
Mostly because we have to buy them black market.  There is a legitimate
certified organic farm out in Kennedy, but getting our kiri to drive out
there is a problem.  She is a big city girl and has a bit of an issue
with out of town non-highway driving.  None of the grocery stores sell
these eggs, so we have to get them under the table from a place that is
not a food store.  You know what a hassle that can be in this state.  
They might turn a blind eye in an area like this to a road side stand
selling their own eggs during season, but an actual shop would likely get
the book thrown at them.  
So far as soy, I am really ticked off about that.
I know a guy who grows a heritage variety for his own use.  The japanese
"beer friend" variety to be specific.  I have no problem eating those.  
For years I had no problem eating any kind of soy.  Then all of a sudden
I ate a soy sausage and nearly ended up in the ER.  My throat darned near
swelled shut and it felt like I was trying to breathe with a hundred
pound weight on my chest.  Judicious experimentation has led me to
believe that it is the GMO soy that gives me trouble.  Since more than
90% of the US crop is either GMO or GMO contaminated that pretty much
excludes soy from my diet.  I can eat beer friend beans all night long,
but a commercial soy burger is life threatening.  Grrr!
NightMist

Wow, they're that expensive?  DW is carpooling with a woman who raises
her own chickens, and we've been getting eggs from her ('cuz I've always
liked the taste of corn-fed chickens & eggs better).  I know they're a
little more than Weggie'$, but I don't think it's 4x...  You gotta have
some farmers out where you are - are they all that high?
Doc
I never knew there *was* such a thing as store-bought salad dressing
until I started eating away from home - (of course I never knew there
was any kind of dressing other than the horrible vinegar concoction my
mom used to make either...)  I think now we use Marie's dressings from
the produce section (DW can't keep her face out of the bleu cheese) -
I'd have to read the labels, but I 'spect they're not quite as bad as
the shelf stuff...  Fortunately salad dressings are fairly easy & fun to
experiment with!

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much for
organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics. Every now
and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become rather
violently ill with an allergic reaction.  It is not something that
happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that I would
just as soon avoid it.  The easiest way to avoid it is to use organic
eggs.  If I am making something that calls for an egg or two in a dish
that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for just whites, I can
usually get away with the cheaper eggs.  If I want an egg for
breakfast, or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a dozen ones are
more than worth the extra money for me.
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs is a
big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making me ill is
my primary reason for buying the much more expensive organic eggs.
NightMist
--
I'm raising a developmentally disabled child.  What's your superpower?

--
I'm raising a developmentally disabled child.  What's your superpower?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

[NightMist]

We used to have one.
They got hit when the legal sweeps hit.
Man I gotta say, those sweeps should have been stopped and the people
running them should have been fired if not prosecuted. The typical
tactic was somebody coming in and nagging or bullying the place to sell
them something when they weren't a member, and then follow up with a
major raid confiscating everything, and at least threats of charges.
Charges were mostly things like operating a business without a license,
and failure to pay sales tax and stuff. I still haven't figured out what
sales tax they were thinking of since food is not taxed in most places.
A few places that did things like buy a couple of cows on the hoof and
then split them up were threatened with charges for selling uninspected
meat. It was hard for the co-ops to prove anything in their favor since
the feds took all the computers and paperwork when they confiscated
stuff. Most places they even cleaned out the personal pantry and freezer
of the family that was the delivery address. Entrapment followed by
unwarrantedly harsh treatment, it scared the bejeebers out of a lot of
the co-ops, and they were afraid to start back up.

I keep hoping the current administration gets around to smacking the USDA
and the FDA upside the head. They have so many more important things
they should be doing instead of messing with a couple dozen co-ops that
buy from local farms instead of industry.

NightMist

Post by Dr. Zachary Smith
Night,
I just checked with management.
Eggs at Weggie$ are about a buck;
Pastel carpool eggs are a buck-fifty.
I expect your middlemen are getting the bulk.
We used to get pastels from a friend in the Finger Lakes whenever we saw
her, but that's been years...
Got a good co-op down there?
Doc

Post by NightMist
Yep, here they are that expensive.
Mostly because we have to buy them black market.  There is a legitimate
certified organic farm out in Kennedy, but getting our kiri to drive
out there is a problem.  She is a big city girl and has a bit of an
issue with out of town non-highway driving.  None of the grocery stores
sell these eggs, so we have to get them under the table from a place
that is not a food store.  You know what a hassle that can be in this
state. They might turn a blind eye in an area like this to a road side
stand selling their own eggs during season, but an actual shop would
likely get the book thrown at them.
So far as soy, I am really ticked off about that. I know a guy who
grows a heritage variety for his own use.  The japanese "beer friend"
variety to be specific.  I have no problem eating those. For years I
had no problem eating any kind of soy.  Then all of a sudden I ate a
soy sausage and nearly ended up in the ER.  My throat darned near
swelled shut and it felt like I was trying to breathe with a hundred
pound weight on my chest.  Judicious experimentation has led me to
believe that it is the GMO soy that gives me trouble.  Since more than
90% of the US crop is either GMO or GMO contaminated that pretty much
excludes soy from my diet.  I can eat beer friend beans all night long,
but a commercial soy burger is life threatening.  Grrr!
NightMist

Wow, they're that expensive?  DW is carpooling with a woman who
raises her own chickens, and we've been getting eggs from her ('cuz
I've always liked the taste of corn-fed chickens & eggs better).  I
know they're a little more than Weggie'$, but I don't think it's
4x...  You gotta have some farmers out where you are - are they all
that high?
Doc
I never knew there *was* such a thing as store-bought salad dressing
until I started eating away from home - (of course I never knew there
was any kind of dressing other than the horrible vinegar concoction
my mom used to make either...)  I think now we use Marie's dressings
from the produce section (DW can't keep her face out of the bleu
cheese) - I'd have to read the labels, but I 'spect they're not quite
as bad as the shelf stuff...  Fortunately salad dressings are fairly
easy & fun to experiment with!

Post by NightMist
Got the query in email and decided to answer in group.
While I am not a big fan of factory farms, which is where a lot of
commercial eggs come from, that is not why I pay four times as much
for organic eggs.
I am allergic to two of the main groups of cheap antibiotics. Every
now and again when I eat the cheaper grocery store eggs I become
rather violently ill with an allergic reaction.  It is not something
that happens every time I eat them, but it is unpleasant enough that
I would just as soon avoid it.  The easiest way to avoid it is to
use organic eggs.  If I am making something that calls for an egg or
two in a dish that makes 8 or ten servings, or one that calls for
just whites, I can usually get away with the cheaper eggs.  If I
want an egg for breakfast, or I am making a yolk rich dish, the $4 a
dozen ones are more than worth the extra money for me.
Buying locally is a big plus, the far superior quality of the eggs
is a big plus, supporting happy chickens is a plus, but not making
me ill is my primary reason for buying the much more expensive
organic eggs.

[Joanna]

This reminds me of my issue with whole wheat. I can not have whole wheat
bread or even 60%. But the new SMART bread up here in Canada lists whole
wheat as an ingredient and I can have it no problem. I once ate a pie
with whole wheat flour in the crust and reacted to that. My dr says it's
technically not an allergy. I get the runs then stomach cramps so bad I
can't stand up for about three days and everything I eat for those 3
days goes right through me within an hour. I suspect it might not even
be the whole wheat itself but an additive something to due that's added
with the whole wheat. Because there are things I've come across like a
few cakes that have whole wheat listed as a lower ingredient and I was
fine. The dr's keep telling me there is no way to figure out what
exactly it is as it might be something in the treatment or cleaning of
the wheat that I react to. It makes life frustrating though when you are
trying to eat healthy. For a couple of years I even had a fear that I
would no longer get my bread cuz everyone seemed to be on the health
kick thing not buying anything that was white. But it seems to have
settled. I can also have things like multigrain bagels no problem. I
even had one dr tell me I wasn't really trying to loss weight if I
wouldn't eat whole wheat bread. Needless to say she's no longer my dr. I
like hearing what others are having issues with though. I have a little
one that reacts to things and right now she has a rash on her bum and I
can not figure out what is causing it. So I'll watch for the soy next time.
Take Care
joanna

Post by NightMist
Yep, here they are that expensive.
Mostly because we have to buy them black market. There is a legitimate
certified organic farm out in Kennedy, but getting our kiri to drive out
there is a problem. She is a big city girl and has a bit of an issue
with out of town non-highway driving. None of the grocery stores sell
these eggs, so we have to get them under the table from a place that is
not a food store. You know what a hassle that can be in this state.
They might turn a blind eye in an area like this to a road side stand
selling their own eggs during season, but an actual shop would likely get
the book thrown at them.
So far as soy, I am really ticked off about that.
I know a guy who grows a heritage variety for his own use. The japanese
"beer friend" variety to be specific. I have no problem eating those.
For years I had no problem eating any kind of soy. Then all of a sudden
I ate a soy sausage and nearly ended up in the ER. My throat darned near
swelled shut and it felt like I was trying to breathe with a hundred
pound weight on my chest. Judicious experimentation has led me to
believe that it is the GMO soy that gives me trouble. Since more than
90% of the US crop is either GMO or GMO contaminated that pretty much
excludes soy from my diet. I can eat beer friend beans all night long,
but a commercial soy burger is life threatening. Grrr!
NightMist
O

[Marcella Peek]

It's all about demand.

Here organic "cage free" (for what that's worth) eggs are $3.50 - $4 a
dozen at the market. Same price at the farmers market if I think to go
and buy eggs on Saturday.

Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early. People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.

marcella

In article

Post by Dr. Zachary Smith
Wow, they're that expensive? DW is carpooling with a woman who raises
her own chickens, and we've been getting eggs from her ('cuz I've
always liked the taste of corn-fed chickens & eggs better). I know
they're a little more than Weggie'$, but I don't think it's 4x... You
gotta have some farmers out where you are - are they all that high?
Doc

[Dr. Zachary Smith]

Post by Marcella Peek
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs

Mmmmm... LOVE that BUGGY Flavor!!!

[Taria]

My understanding is that they call 'free range' just amounts to opening the
door like you say. They are too afraid to go out so they just sit inside.
Boy labels can sure be deceiving. I want chickens but we can't have them
here in the city. My sis right in town can have them in San Diego. Go
figure.
I doubt I'd get many eggs from chickens that had to live in the vicinity of
Ginger pooch. Sis seems to feed too many hawks out of her canyon lot.
It probably is too hot here anyway. I need to move somewhere with a more
moderate summer.
Taria

Post by Marcella Peek
It's all about demand.
Here organic "cage free" (for what that's worth) eggs are $3.50 - $4 a
dozen at the market. Same price at the farmers market if I think to go
and buy eggs on Saturday.
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early. People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.
marcella

[ME-Judy]

On the topic of chickens and "natural bugs" --- One of our neighbors raises
"natural" chickens for their eggs. They bring us over a dozen when their
chickens lay an abundance for them. We return the favor by sharing veggies
from our garden all summer. We got to talking about bugs-in-the-garden
yesterday - especially the japanese beetles (which have become a huge pest,
devouring the leaves on sunflower, green bean and beet plants). Neighbor
said that her chickens LOVE them! So I told her she was more than welcome to
come over and "harvest" them.... I usually pick them off and throw into a
can with soapy water inside (so they can't fly out - the soap goops up their
wings.) (Neighbor just uses plain water. Maine has a motto "ReUse,
Reduce, and recycle" --we love it! We both are doing well in that regard!
ME-Judy

Post by Marcella Peek
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early. People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.
marcella

[Dr. Zachary Smith]

Garden places et al have Japanese Beetle traps (ours are yellow
plastic fins with a plastic bag attached below) that work great. Hang
one up and it'll be full in a day or week...

On the topic of chickens and "natural bugs" ---  One of our neighbors raises
"natural" chickens for their eggs.  They bring us over a dozen when their
chickens lay an abundance for them. We return the favor by sharing veggies
from our garden all summer.  We got to talking about bugs-in-the-garden
yesterday - especially the japanese beetles (which have become a huge pest,
devouring the leaves on sunflower, green bean and beet plants). Neighbor
said that her chickens LOVE them! So I told her she was more than welcome to
come over and "harvest" them.... I usually pick them off and throw into a
can with soapy water inside (so they can't fly out - the soap goops up their
wings.)   (Neighbor just uses plain water.  Maine has a motto "ReUse,
Reduce, and recycle" --we love it! We both are doing well in that regard!
ME-Judy

Post by Marcella Peek
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early.  People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.
marcella- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

[NightMist]

Gotta chime in on this...

If you use traps make for gosh darn sure you put them a good long ways
from what you are trying to protect. They work because they are baited,
and the bait will attract the things. A bag of beetles is a lot less
impressive when most of them flew in from the neighbor's yards, and half
the ones that flew in blew off the bag in favor of your roses.

I plant garlic and other alliums near susceptible plants, and plant four
o'clocks. Japanese beetles are very unfond of alliums, especially garlic.
They absolutely adore four o'clocks, which are deadly to them. They come
into the yard, steer clear of the roses because the roses are surrounded
by garlic, then scent the four o'clocks, decide they are a delight and
chow down, and then promptly die.
It works. My neighbor has been boggled at how beetle free my yard and
garden are. I happily passed on my method.

NightMist

Garden places et al have Japanese Beetle traps (ours are yellow plastic
fins with a plastic bag attached below) that work great. Hang one up
and it'll be full in a day or week...

On the topic of chickens and "natural bugs" ---  One of our neighbors
raises "natural" chickens for their eggs.  They bring us over a dozen
when their chickens lay an abundance for them. We return the favor by
sharing veggies from our garden all summer.  We got to talking about
bugs-in-the-garden yesterday - especially the japanese beetles (which
have become a huge pest, devouring the leaves on sunflower, green bean
and beet plants). Neighbor said that her chickens LOVE them! So I told
her she was more than welcome to come over and "harvest" them.... I
usually pick them off and throw into a can with soapy water inside (so
they can't fly out - the soap goops up their wings.)   (Neighbor just
uses plain water.  Maine has a motto "ReUse, Reduce, and recycle" --we
love it! We both are doing well in that regard! ME-Judy

Post by Marcella Peek
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the
farmer's market and the lady runs out early.  People want them, can
taste the difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to
pay that much for generally smallish eggs.
marcella- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

[ME-Judy]

We've got garlic / shallots / onions all around the garden - doesn't help
much. BUT I like your idea about the four o'clocks.... will have to look
into that (unless my neighbor's collecting for her chickens -- don't want
any "bad" stuff in the chicken-feed.)
I second your comment on the results of a Japanese Beetle trap. We tried
it ONE year - we got bugs from all over the neighborhood!
ME-Judy

Post by NightMist
Gotta chime in on this...
If you use traps make for gosh darn sure you put them a good long ways
from what you are trying to protect. They work because they are baited,
and the bait will attract the things. A bag of beetles is a lot less
impressive when most of them flew in from the neighbor's yards, and half
the ones that flew in blew off the bag in favor of your roses.
I plant garlic and other alliums near susceptible plants, and plant four
o'clocks. Japanese beetles are very unfond of alliums, especially garlic.
They absolutely adore four o'clocks, which are deadly to them. They come
into the yard, steer clear of the roses because the roses are surrounded
by garlic, then scent the four o'clocks, decide they are a delight and
chow down, and then promptly die.
It works. My neighbor has been boggled at how beetle free my yard and
garden are. I happily passed on my method.
NightMist

[NightMist]

There are other plants as well. It is just that I happen to love four
o'clocks. They are also very easy to grow, and self seed prolifically
even in cold climates. A big plus about growing them in a cold climate
is you get them from reseeding every year, and if you decide you don't
want them there next year, you just deadhead or cut them back before they
start to form seeds, and you have them under control. In warm climates
they go perennial and are almost impossible to keep reined in.

Larkspur, tansy, and geranium are all reputed to kill japanese beetles.
Larkspur makes one of the few good natural blue dyes. It is hard to beat
a nosegay of tansy for a stuffed head, or even a chest cold. You don't
want to eat the stuff though, and neither should your animals. I have
never really fancied geraniums. Dunno why, they can be a very nice
addition to a planned garden.

Catnip and rue are supposed to be some of the best beetle repellents. I
have those too. Maybe I have been giving the garlic more credit than it
is due, or maybe the repellents work better in the presence of an
attractant. Makes sense that they would doesn't it?

NightMist

Post by ME-Judy
We've got garlic / shallots / onions all around the garden - doesn't
help much. BUT I like your idea about the four o'clocks.... will have
to look into that (unless my neighbor's collecting for her chickens --
don't want any "bad" stuff in the chicken-feed.)
I second your comment on the results of a Japanese Beetle trap. We tried
it ONE year - we got bugs from all over the neighborhood! ME-Judy

Post by NightMist
Gotta chime in on this...
If you use traps make for gosh darn sure you put them a good long ways
from what you are trying to protect. They work because they are
baited, and the bait will attract the things. A bag of beetles is a
lot less impressive when most of them flew in from the neighbor's
yards, and half the ones that flew in blew off the bag in favor of your
roses.
I plant garlic and other alliums near susceptible plants, and plant
four o'clocks. Japanese beetles are very unfond of alliums, especially
garlic. They absolutely adore four o'clocks, which are deadly to them.
They come into the yard, steer clear of the roses because the roses are
surrounded by garlic, then scent the four o'clocks, decide they are a
delight and chow down, and then promptly die.
It works. My neighbor has been boggled at how beetle free my yard and
garden are. I happily passed on my method.
NightMist

[ME-Judy]

Thanks for the alternative plants! We do have 5 or 6 geraniums in the
flower bed next to the garden. Will have to grow more of 'em.
ME-Judy

Post by NightMist
There are other plants as well. It is just that I happen to love four
o'clocks. They are also very easy to grow, and self seed prolifically
even in cold climates. A big plus about growing them in a cold climate
is you get them from reseeding every year, and if you decide you don't
want them there next year, you just deadhead or cut them back before they
start to form seeds, and you have them under control. In warm climates
they go perennial and are almost impossible to keep reined in.
Larkspur, tansy, and geranium are all reputed to kill japanese beetles.
Larkspur makes one of the few good natural blue dyes. It is hard to beat
a nosegay of tansy for a stuffed head, or even a chest cold. You don't
want to eat the stuff though, and neither should your animals. I have
never really fancied geraniums. Dunno why, they can be a very nice
addition to a planned garden.
Catnip and rue are supposed to be some of the best beetle repellents. I
have those too. Maybe I have been giving the garlic more credit than it
is due, or maybe the repellents work better in the presence of an
attractant. Makes sense that they would doesn't it?
NightMist

[Sherry]

Post by Marcella Peek
It's all about demand.
Here organic "cage free" (for what that's worth) eggs are $3.50 - $4 a
dozen at the market.  Same price at the farmers market if I think to go
and buy eggs on Saturday.
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early.  People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.
marcella

I buy "cage-free" eggs, but I don't think that necessarily means
organic, does it? I feel too sorry for battery hens to buy the other
kind. And yes, chickens ought to be out running around chasing bugs
and doing chicken things until their poor little necks are chopped
off. At least then
they only have one bad day.
I'm not vegetarian or anything. I just think we *owe* them a humane
life as well as a humane death.

Sherry

[kratersge]

Post by Marcella Peek
Here organic "cage free" (for what that's worth) eggs are $3.50 - $4 a
dozen at the market.  Same price at the farmers market if I think to go
and buy eggs on Saturday.
Pastured eggs from chickens who actually run around a pasture and eat
bugs and grasses and seeds - and not sit in a barn with a teeny open
door in a corner that they never exit - cost $8 a dozen at the farmer's
market and the lady runs out early.  People want them, can taste the
difference and willingly get there at 9 am and line up to pay that much
for generally smallish eggs.
marcella

 I buy "cage-free" eggs, but I don't think that necessarily means
organic, does it? I feel too sorry for battery hens to buy the other
kind. And yes, chickens ought to be out running around chasing bugs
and doing chicken things until their poor little necks are chopped
off. At least then
they only have one bad day.
I'm not vegetarian or anything. I just think we *owe* them a humane
life as well as a humane death.
Sherry

Chiming in on "cage free". Anyone read the Omivar's Dilema?

I'm pretty much giving up on buying organic chicken. Even non-organic
is hormone/anti-biotic free by regulation, and the "free range"
chickens only really have an open door to a tiny exercise yard for the
last couple weeks of their life, by which time they've already been
trained to stay in. Good thing, since they exercise "range" is so
small it would hold only a few of them.

Susan K

[Julia in MN]

Post by kratersge
Chiming in on "cage free". Anyone read the Omivar's Dilema?

I've read Omnivore's Dilemma -- very interesting. I have some
agricultural background and found the descriptions of the different
farming methods very interesting. I especially enjoyed the second
section on sustainable farming. It's quite long but worth reading if
you're interested in how your food gets to you.

Post by kratersge
I'm pretty much giving up on buying organic chicken. Even non-organic
is hormone/anti-biotic free by regulation, and the "free range"
chickens only really have an open door to a tiny exercise yard for the
last couple weeks of their life, by which time they've already been
trained to stay in. Good thing, since they exercise "range" is so
small it would hold only a few of them.

I think the plus for free-range chickens is not the exercise, but the
food supply. If they are truly free-range, they will be eating grass,
weeds, bugs, and the like. I grew up on a farm and we always had
chickens. In the summer when the chickens were running free, the egg
yolks had a darker color due to the difference in the hens' diet. Also
when the cows started going to pasture in the spring, the milk started
to taste different due to the change in diet.

Julia in MN

[Dr. Zachary Smith]

On Jul 23, 12:40 pm, Julia in MN <jaccola-AT-chartermi-

Post by Julia in MN
I think the plus for free-range chickens is not the exercise, but the
food supply. If they are truly free-range, they will be eating grass,
weeds, bugs, and the like. I grew up on a farm and we always had
chickens. In the summer when the chickens were running free, the egg
yolks had a darker color due to the difference in the hens' diet. Also
when the cows started going to pasture in the spring, the milk started
to taste different due to the change in diet.

Everything tastes better when raised "the old-fashioned way". But we
don't live in the 19th - or early 20th century anymore. Raising food
the way some of us think it ought to be done has become a luxury,
which is obvious at the checkout. In the big picture, compromises
were/are made to feed more people for less cost. The same evils that
apply to Wal-mart apply to agribusiness (and quiltibusiness for that
matter - LQSs vs. Jo-Ann/Wal-mart) - we needn't re-hash the sacrifices
& downsides. Those who can afford it will always eat "better" (and
live "better" in other ways) than those who cannot. We all do the
best we can.

Doc

[kratersge]

On Jul 23, 12:40 pm, Julia in MN <jaccola-AT-chartermi-

Post by Julia in MN
I've read Omnivore's Dilemma -- very interesting. I have some
agricultural background and found the descriptions of the different
farming methods very interesting. I especially enjoyed the second
section on sustainable farming. It's quite long but worth reading if
you're interested in how your food gets to you.
I think the plus for free-range chickens is not the exercise, but the
food supply. If they are truly free-range, they will be eating grass,
weeds, bugs, and the like. I grew up on a farm and we always had
chickens. In the summer when the chickens were running free, the egg
yolks had a darker color due to the difference in the hens' diet. Also
when the cows started going to pasture in the spring, the milk started
to taste different due to the change in diet.
Julia in MN

Thanks for the bug fix on my spelling. I was fascinated by the
Polyface Farm section. I wish we had something like that I could
use.

I'm trying really hard to not buy conventional beef but it's tough.
The Fresh Market sells grass fed strip steaks, and I'm using ground
bison because it's fairly local and won't be coming out of the big
McDonalds hamburge factory. But outside of that, there's not much
around here.

Susan K

[Love is]

On Jul 23, 12:40 pm, Julia in MN <jaccola-AT-chartermi-

Post by Julia in MN
I've read Omnivore's Dilemma -- very interesting. I have some
agricultural background and found the descriptions of the different
farming methods very interesting. I especially enjoyed the second
section on sustainable farming. It's quite long but worth reading if
you're interested in how your food gets to you.
I think the plus for free-range chickens is not the exercise, but the
food supply. If they are truly free-range, they will be eating grass,
weeds, bugs, and the like. I grew up on a farm and we always had
chickens. In the summer when the chickens were running free, the egg
yolks had a darker color due to the difference in the hens' diet. Also
when the cows started going to pasture in the spring, the milk started
to taste different due to the change in diet.
Julia in MN

Thanks for the bug fix on my spelling. I was fascinated by the
Polyface Farm section. I wish we had something like that I could
use.
I'm trying really hard to not buy conventional beef but it's tough.
The Fresh Market sells grass fed strip steaks, and I'm using ground
bison because it's fairly local and won't be coming out of the big
McDonalds hamburge factory. But outside of that, there's not much
around here.
Susan K

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